Dialogue from between the world, a film connecting Lithuania and Senegal

The film Dialogue from between the Worlds, produced by the National Kaunas Drama Theatre (Lithuania) in collaboration with RAW Material Company (Senegal) as part of the DECONFINING project premiered at the Romuva cinema in Kaunas on 21 November. The film reconstructs the imaginary meeting of two cinematic geniuses: Ousmane Sembène from Senegal and Jonas Mekas from Lithuania.

The creative process of the film connecting Senegalese and Lithuanian cultures was filmed in two phases. The first occurred in the winter of 2024 in several locations in Lithuania, while the second phase was carried out in the summer of the same year in Dakar, Senegal. The film’s partner was RAW Material Company, an international art and research centre established in Dakar. Dialogue from between the Worlds was produced by the artistic collective from The School of Mutants: Stéphane Bottéro, Hamedine Kane and Valérie Osouf. Naubertas Jasinskas, a theatre director, and Alassane Sy, a film director from Senegal, also participated in the filming of the film. In this interview with the filmmakers representing the African continent, we delve into the cultural climate and the filmmaking process.

• Please introduce yourselves as artists. Do you collaborate frequently? Please describe the issues and themes that are currently of interest to you.

We are Valérie Osouf, Stéphane V. Bottéro and Hamedine Kane, members of The School of Mutants, a collaborative art and research platform dedicated to exploring themes of resistance, speculative futures, and alternative histories within post-colonial contexts. While we each have a solo practice, we frequently collaborate within The School of Mutants, as each project brings its own forms and collaborators. Together, we are drawn to issues of decolonisation, community, and resilience, particularly where they intersect with environmental and cultural concerns.

• Could you briefly introduce The School of Mutants? What are the ideas and aims behind this artistic collaboration?

The School of Mutants was born from a shared interest in fostering collaborative, interdisciplinary spaces across borders. Our projects explore speculative futures and histories, often addressing the ways in which individuals and places evolve and transform over time. Our objective is to challenge traditional narratives and encourage alternative ways of understanding history and reparation. While there is no official manifesto, certain texts resonate with us deeply, including the works of Frantz Fanon, Seloua Luste Boulbina, Edouard Glissant, and Octavia Butler. Our recent exhibition at Leeds University, inspired by Bamako, a film by Abderrahmane Sissako, was an exploration of these themes and reflected our commitment to creating spaces for creative dialogue and dynamic exploration.

• What is the current artistic and cultural climate in Dakar?

Dakar’s art scene is thriving, with significant events like the Dakar Biennale playing an important role in showcasing contemporary African art on a global stage. Artists in Dakar are engaging with a range of pertinent issues such as urbanisation, ecology, extractivism, and the legacy of colonialism, often exploring these through innovative forms. This creative landscape in Dakar shapes our work, as we actively engage with the community and local narratives while also connecting them to broader global issues.

• Please tell us about the origin and context of the idea behind the film.

The film was born from the desire to bring together two remarkable cinematic voices of the 20th century, Jonas Mekas and Ousmane Sembène, in an imagined dialogue across borders and time. Mekas’s works resonate with themes of exile and nostalgia, while Sembène’s portrayals focus on African emancipation and are firmly rooted in the ideals of the pan-African left. By staging an imaginary conversation between them, we aim to explore the role of cinema as a medium for resistance and connection, as well as its potential and limitations.

• What were the stages of making the film?

The project commenced with a period of research, during which we immersed ourselves in the lives, writings, and communities of Mekas and Sembène. The filming took place in Mekas’s birth village in Lithuania and in Dakar’s Yoff Pecheurs, where Sembène spent much of his life. Capturing these locations on film enabled us to create a poetic sense of presence of both filmmakers, embodied by two actors – Alassane Sy and Naubertas Jasinskas – who are directors themselves. The editing process involved collaboration with both Senegalese and Lithuanian artists, blending perspectives to shape the tone and narrative.

• Part of the process was research. What were the most surprising things that you discovered during the research process?

 

We were struck by the way both Lithuanian and Senegalese cultures place high value on oral storytelling and collective memory. This common thread opened our eyes to the shared importance of storytelling as a form of cultural preservation and resistance, despite very different contexts.

 

• Could you elaborate on the significance of the key visual elements utilised in the film, such as figurines and coastal landscapes?

The images in the film are multi-layered in their meaning. The sea, for instance, serves to illustrate both separation and connection, symbolising exile and diaspora, but also bridging two continents. The figurines and symbolic objects in the film draw on ancestral knowledge, cultural memory, and resistance, visually questioning the basis of common references (including figures such as Andy Warhol, Nina Simone, Ho Chi Minh, Yoko Ono, Allen Ginsberg, Patrice Lumumba, Amilcar Cabral etc.).

• How did you come up with the dialogue heard in the film?

The dialogue is a meticulously crafted, imaginary exchange based on the writings and cinematic works of Mekas and Sembène. Our objective was to capture their shared and conflicting values and worldviews, exploring themes of memory, displacement, and cultural resistance through a dialectical process that honours both voices.

• Could you please provide us with some background information on Ousmane Sembène and his contribution to the cultural landscape of Senegal?

Ousmane Sembène, who was also a novelist and a militant, is a seminal figure in Senegalese culture and Black Heritage, known as the “father of African cinema.” His work provided a new perspective through which Africans could view themselves as autonomous subjects, challenging colonial narratives and promoting self-representation. His influence extends far beyond cinema, acting as a reminder of the power of art in social movements and cultural pride.

• From a contemporary perspective, what is the significance of Sembène? Do younger artists find inspiration in his films and literature?

Undoubtedly. Sembène’s commitment to portraying authentic African experiences and addressing social issues continues to inspire young African filmmakers and artists. His emphasis on storytelling as a catalyst for change and his refusal to conform to Western standards resonate very strongly with a new generation striving to continue his legacy.

• Do you think the reconstruction of the imaginary conversation between Sembène and Mekas could be interesting for Senegalese audiences?

Yes, absolutely. The debate explored in the film resonates deeply with Senegalese audiences. The concept of an “imagined conversation” encourages viewers to consider the internationalism of certain issues while providing a new perspective on Sembène’s legacy as part of a broader cinematic discourse.

• What are your impressions about Lithuania and Lithuanian artistic culture?

Lithuania’s art scene is deeply reflective, with a focus on history, identity, and cultural resilience. There is an ongoing process of re-evaluating collective memory, which aligns with similar movements in Senegal. We were welcomed into a culture of openness and exchange, which enriched our collaboration with Lithuanian artists and communities.

• Have you discovered any parallels between the cultures, landscapes and people of Senegal and Lithuania?

Despite significant geographic and cultural differences, both countries share a challenging history of imperialist occupation. However, they also demonstrate a genuine respect for heritage and collective identity. The landscapes themselves, while different, evince a comparable depth of cultural memory. This discovery of parallels informed many choices in the film’s imagery and narratives.